It would be an understatement to say that there is a lot going on in and around Iran these days, since the start of 2026.
Violent demonstrations and riots have spread across Iran. Now it seems these riots are actually an attempt at a color revolution started by the CIA and Mossad. And then there is President Trump threatening to attack Iran if demonstrators are killed. Reports say the IRGC and Basij have killed anywhere from 500 to 10,000 people. Yet, it seems Trump cannot attack Iran just yet because the Pentagon isn’t ready. One reason may be because the ships needed to support such an offense were gathered around Venezuela.
And now we hear that the riots are dying down and the regime is preserved.
The Second Signpost
So what does all this mean for the Second Signpost? Readers have reached out to me asking what I think may happen next, or what should we pray for.
Cutting through all the noise and events, it really comes down to two alternatives. Option 1 is if the regime falls, then the Second Signpost is done and the Signpost theory of interpretation needs to be re-thought. Option 2 is if the regime survives, then the Second Signpost is launched and the world gets set up in earnest for the end times.
I have my doubts about Option 1. There is just too much Scripture, world history, and geopolitics that have formed a solid argument for the coming of the Second Signpost.
The Alert per Option 2
And if the regime survives long enough, standing up against domestic unrest, and attacks from the US and Israel, the Second Signpost could begin at any moment with no warning. True, there would likely need to be a military buildup in the plains surrounding Susa in order to stage an invasion, but there may be ways for a military buildup that doesn’t attract too much attention. The Basij and its motorcycles won’t look like tanks.
And there is always Russia or China starting WW3 one way or another.
Pray and Watch
So what might we pray for right now?
Pray for strength to stand up under the coming trials and tests, which will indeed come, but now may come sooner than later if the Second Signpost is an absolute surprise to us all.
Pray for sensitivity to the Holy Spirit to do the things He would want you to do.
Continue to seek His kingdom and His righteousness so your needs will be met, for He has promised. Don’t bother praying for the economy as I have heard some Christians say—be in the Bride and stay rooted in Christ per Matthew 6:33, and not in idolatry in the Harlot.
Categories: ALERT, In The News, Signpost #2: Iran
THE FOUR SIGNPOSTS 
Dear Brother “Mark Davidson”: I do not rejoice that the Four Signposts interpretation looks unfulfillable right now. I believe that it will be fulfilled after some wonderfully good things happen first. The Four Signposts describe a series of bad things happening that culminate in the reign of a Muslim Antichrist, just as the Bible says. But the all powerful and good God we pray to and worship can cause wonderfully good things to happen that override whatever sequence towards evil He allows to happen. Do not think that your signpost interpretation was only a theory. It is a valid interpretation of what Bible prophecies indicate. The only concern I have had was that you seemed to want to see that evil sequence of events fulfilled regardless of whatever sequences of good events God has planned that God also spoke of through his prophets. I believe that we are in total disagreement over modern day prophets. The ones that have appealed to you predict that forces of evil will triumph over forces for good until Christ returns and makes everything right. The ones I study all say that there will be a time when for much of the world evil will triumph over good, but before that great tribulation some wonderful events will take place that will bring the gospel of Christ to all nations before the evil sequence of events you have written about is allowed to continue to its completion. As I now see it, the first signpost set up the eventual second signpost involving Iran. But instead of fulfilling what prophecies say, Iran foolishly decided to use proxies to attack Israel. Daniel 8 says that Iran will attack the Muslim nations to the west, north, and south. That must eventually happen, even if the present government of Iran disintegrates, as the prophets I listen to have indicated would happen. The malicious survivors of the current Iranian regime will simply reorganize and stir up enough of the people to regain power, but this time to make direct attacks against Muslim nations friendly with Israel, setting things up for the third signpost led by Türkiye. I have been diagnosed with terminal cancer, but for now I am still able to study the Bible and work at my computer. At age 79 I may not live to see the resumption of the evil sequence of events known as the Four Signposts. But I may live to see many glorious events, such as the fall of American and Israeli deep states, the fall of evil regimes, the fall of corrupt media, the return of America and Israel to their purposes within God’s plans, and spiritually blessed people and events leading to the gospel of Christ being heard and responded to all around the world. So I may get to rejoice when good stuff happens, and miss out on the really bad stuff that must follow in large portions of the world. http://www.jgminternational.org/prophecies/its-time-to-bring-all-fake-governments-to-their-knees JM
Landza,
Thanks for your post. Please don’t misunderstand me, on two counts. First, I don’t “want to see that evil sequence of events fulfilled.” I just see it as coming, from all my info. Secondly, I don’t follow prophets, that is, “the ones that have appealed to you predict that forces of evil will triumph over forces for good.” I only follow the Scriptures, and the news, both the correct alt-media, and the MSM to see what the elite’s narrative is wanting us to believe. Yes, there are a small handful of what I believe to be true prophets out there, and they all talk about awful things coming, but I do not base my position on their messages. The way I look at all this is, God is allowing evil and greater evil, in order to bring about His final triumph over evil.
“Wonderful” things will happen like tens of millions of people coming to Christ in a very real way, but I don’t see that happening until some truly awful conditions strike. The revival will happen, but only in the midst of chaos. (It’s as Corrie Ten Boom said – “People don’t know Christ is all you need until Christ is all you have.”) Two hundred million Chinese didn’t come to Christ until Mao did his thing with the Cultural Revolution. Millions wont come to Christ in Europe and the Middle East until Antichrist does his thing. And the millions to come here in the Americas wont come until we are dirt poor.
Sorry, that’s just how I see it. And again, its not due to any prophecy outside of Scripture. And yes, I do not believe the “prophets” out there in the church right now talking about prosperity and wonderful things coming. Folks like Kim Clement are false prophets. Remember, even if ONLY ONE prophecy they utter as a “the Lord says” does not come true, they are a false prophet. One that comes to mind is about Trump, and how he will be a man “of few words” which, or course, is just the opposite of Trump.
Keep in mind too, brother, that all three branches of Christianity have their idols they hold above Christ. Catholicism/Orthodoxy hold their rituals and leaders’ messages (like Encyclicals and Catechisms) above Scripture and obedience to Christ (see Luke 11:7-8, John 6:52). Protestantism holds its theologies above Christ and so rather than loving Christ followers they shun them as heretics (see John 5:39-40). And Pentecostalism must have its signs and wonders whether “tongues” or whatever other “gifts” they feel must be present all the time (see Matthew 12:38-40, Mark 8:11-12). Christians’ need for the manifestations of miraculous gifts, or for a specific theology (as if they believe they have rightly divined all that Scripture says, ironically just like everyone else has), or for a leader to absolve people of their sins by attending Mass, are replacements for the need for Christ and only Christ.
I have never had the gift of tongues, and won’t, unless at some point the Spirit loans it to me based on the Spirit’s direction, nor do I have the gift of prophecy unless the Spirit directs it at that time.
But by following Christ, and trying to obey His commands and relying on Him, it was Christ and His power that averted the Colorado brush fire that burned down the house 2 doors down from me a year ago. And when I prayed, “God, in Jesus name, I ask you to please divert the fire away from my house and my next door neighbor’s house, Amen” and how within 30 seconds the wind had changed direction 60 degrees from my direction, so that all that thick smoke went out over a body of water to where the house 2 doors down was completely destroyed, but my neighbor’s house just 30 feet away was untouched, that is God’s power. And, besides preserving my house, God is using that miracle as a witness to my neighbor and others that God is real and He should be followed. His power and manifestations come when God decides, and not by any act or wish of man.
And regarding the link, the first four paragraphs are completely compatible with the Second Signpost. As for the rest of it, who knows when these things will happen? They could happen before the chaos hits, during the chaos, or at the end. Also of all the things foretold like governments collapsing, may sound uplifting, but remember they could also happen because of the chaos.
The Second Signpost will start a series of events culminating with the coming of the Antichrist, that will simply wipe away, and change the paradigm, for how the western world and its elites operate.
by all account it looks like Iran is getting stronger, and is able to deal with the protesters, as well as dealing with infiltrations and their communications I have no doubt Russia and China are helping them now and they are prepared for any attack.. in future it does not take any time to start a war. lots of lying going on up there both sides, who knows maybe it will be Iran instead of Israel that starts it.
Hello Mark,
Perhaps Reza represents the higher horn that comes up last but that the ram will charge out and be put down by the conspicuous horn-Trump, when the Ayatollah is removed and Reza returns and a New Persia is folded Into the Cyrus Accords as an addendum to the Abrahamic Accords. Note Trump’s boast about being the only one who could go across the earth without touching the ground. Also, what did he mean when he was conspicuously meeting the many on October 13 and declaring this is the deal we have all been waiting for for 3000 years. More to chew on.
2nd signpost still very active and soon.
Blessings,
Jonathan
Hi Jonah,
Daniel Revisited presents the entire framework of the Signpost theory of interpretation. If elements of that framework are changed due to “what-if’s” than the framework does not stand, and the Signposts are not declared.
The conspicuous horn is the king of Yavan, i.e. Erdogan or another Turk that might replace him.
The Cyrus Accords and Abraham Accords will disappear when Iran runs out, as many of the signatory countries will be absorbed into the new Iranian Shia Empire. The Second Signpost will not only set the world on the path to the end times, but radically change the Middle East. And Turkey has the greatest airlift capability in NATO outside of the US.
Keep in mind too that all the figures and personalities will be, and are, Middle Eastern, and not from the West.
Mark: If Iran had attacked during the Obama or Biden years and cut off oil to the world I could certainly understand how that would take peace from the earth, make men frightened, make people fall apart, etc. If Iran attacked NOW and defeated the United States that would ALL THE MORE cause men, and especially conservatives, fall apart, and instill stark raging fear. If Iran (through Russian or Chinese EMP weapons or Anti-ICE riots, etc.) takes out Trump or the U.S. Military I can think of nothing that would panic the right more than that. The far left would rejoice over our defeat and Trump’s defeat just as much as the Beast’s supporters rejoiced over the death of the two witnesses in Rev.11.
I compare Trump to King Josiah in 2 Chronicles 35. Josiah was a good King, but when God sent Pharaoh Neco to do battle at Carchemish Josiah tried to stop him. Josiah tried to interfere with God’s plan and died as a result. I have prayed for years that not only would Trump be saved but that the message of Daniel 7&8 would get to him. During Trump’s first term he said that “As long as I am president Iran will never get the Bomb.” God allowed the NWO to steal the election from the American people.
Rhetorically speaking Trump has backed himself into a corner. He can’t abandon the Iranian people after promising them deliverance. If he did no one would trust him again. He certainly can’t violate prophecy either. I had hopes that he would have found an excuse to withdraw from the Middle East such as: “Let Israel take care of it”. He has said that we are going back to The Monroe Doctrine (or as other have rephrased it The DONroe Doctrine), but the Monroe Doctrine asserts that not only do we not let other global powers into the Western Hemisphere, but that we stay out of the Eastern Hemisphere. If he had done that I would politically speaking had more hope. He is biting off more than he can chew.
I don’t know how to pray. I don’t want to postpone the arrival of the Kingdom and I don’t want to leave the Iranian people oppressed.
Karl
Karl,
Good thoughts.
I, too, have thought of Trump as Josiah – the last good ruler who was also being preceded and succeeded by evil rulers.
Regarding what to pray for, I’ve been thinking and praying about that too. We should pray God’s will be done, and that we are ready for it, and that we ask His Spirit to search our hearts for any idolatry that needs to go. Once the Second Signpost strikes alot of the current plans of the West – whether the elites globalist plans or the Left’s marxist/evil plans, or even conservatives plans – will be either ended or radically affected. Pray that revival comes – real revival that comes in poverty and chaos – and that you are ready for it.
Praying like this wont change the arrival of the kingdom. And regarding Iran’s people being oppressed – this is just the beginning. When the Fourth Signpost shows up, the whole Muslim Realm will be oppressed. The Third Signpost might give the Iranians some breathing room.
Mark:
I was talking with a friend this morning about these things. He’s a great bible student who comes to many of our conclusion without having read any books on prophecy. I was expressing my concerns over the events in the Middle East and a passage in Mathew came to mind. The conversation between Christ and Peter. Christ said he HAD to go to Jerusalem and die. Peter rebukes Christ! Christ responds “Get thee behind me Satan for you: thou art an offense unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.”KJV
I can’t help to see the parallel. As I see it Trump doomed the U.S. by promising to interfere with prophecy. Is there something I’m missing?
Karl
Karl,
I don’t think you are missing anything. I’ve often thought of things like this, and with past presidents. If Trump does trigger the Second Signpost by losing a war with Iran, then it was simply God’s will all along. His Word looks like the Second Signpost will happen, no matter what (as when Jesus says if the people didn’t cry out, then the stones would simply because God’s Word said there would be praise – “Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord”, or in Hebrew that I hope I’m not massacring too badly, “Bahrut h’ba basham Yacobah”).
Now, things like the Second Signpost must happen but it is possible it could happen different ways depending on how people pray. But God saw this happen, and knew about since eternity past and eternity future, and so there is no way to avoid it. And since we don’t know how to pray the specifics, I think we should pray in generalities as I wrote you in my last response.
Mark is it your contention that the United States is not to be involved with this war against Iran? it doesn’t specifically say that in the Bible? The first sign post the Americans and the West was all over the attack on Iraq, because other countries are not mentioned as supporting actors does mean they will not seriously get involved, as a matter of fact I see them taking a leading role against Iran. and also the US and coalition of the willing probably will be supporting Turkey when it’s their time up to bat. this does not mean that the countries associated with Turkey like Egypt will not be a part of 3 sign post, so by Egypt being a part of the Turkish or the goat attack on Iran still fulfills scripture. or am I reading what you’re saying wrong? I’ve read your book and you seem to suggest only certain countries will be attacking Iran when it’s their time to go forward and fight.
A Reassessment of the Second Signpost in Daniel 8
This comment proposes a refinement to the commonly held “signpost theory” as articulated by Mark Davidson in Daniel Revisited, specifically concerning the interpretation of the second signpost associated with Daniel 8 and the rise of Persia (the Ram). While affirming the usefulness of signposts as prophetic markers rather than strict timelines, this commentor argues that the prevailing insistence on a future, discrete Iranian military invasion of the Middle East as a necessary fulfillment is overly dogmatic and misaligned with the biblical text.
Daniel 8 presents the Ram as a dominant power that “did as it pleased and became great” (Dan. 8:4). Notably, the text emphasizes authority, dominance, and unchecked influence, rather than the mechanics of territorial invasion. The prophecy does not require a singular, identifiable military campaign into Israel or the broader Middle East. Rather, it describes a condition in which Persian power reaches maturity and regional supremacy prior to its sudden defeat by the Goat from the west.
From this perspective, the Islamic Revolution of 1979 serves as a compelling and sufficient fulfillment marker for the Ram’s rise. In that event, Iran reemerged not merely as a nation-state, but as an ideologically unified, theocratic power openly hostile to the Western order. Since that time, Persia has exercised sustained regional dominance through asymmetric and proxy means—militias, ideological exportation, religious authority, and indirect warfare—effectively “pushing west, north, and south” without the necessity of conventional invasion. This transformation marked a decisive and irreversible shift in Middle Eastern power dynamics, consistent with the signpost concept as a structural change rather than a headline event.
Consequently, the expectation of a future Iranian invasion as a prerequisite for moving forward in the prophetic sequence risks misreading the nature of biblical fulfillment. It confuses process with punctiliar event and may delay recognition of the transition already in place. If the Ram’s ascent has indeed reached its apex in the modern era, then the present moment aligns more naturally with the next phase of Daniel 8: the arrival of the Goat from the west.
The Goat is characterized by speed, fury, and sudden impact, striking the Ram “without touching the ground” (Dan. 8:5–7). This imagery suggests overwhelming force and rapid collapse rather than prolonged, symmetrical warfare. In a modern context, such a blow need not be limited to traditional battlefield engagement but may include economic, technological, political, or internal destabilization mechanisms—means by which Western power could swiftly shatter Persian dominance.
Importantly, Daniel’s vision does not glorify the Goat indefinitely. The large horn is later broken, reinforcing that Western supremacy itself is temporary and subject to judgment. This guards against triumphalism and preserves the theological balance of the text.
In summary, this position affirms the signpost framework while proposing that the second signpost should be understood as already fulfilled in principle through Iran’s post-1979 rise as a dominant ideological power. This reading better honors the biblical emphasis on authority and condition rather than spectacle and allows the prophetic sequence to move forward coherently into the present era without forcing an unnecessary future event.
Hi Hopeful,
No, I’m not saying the USA must be involved at all in attacking Iran. True, it turns out the USA provided the force to make the lion stand and change his mind, i.e. the First Signpost, but that doesn’t mean any specific outside power must be present for the Second. However, the US military present in the region has been a deterrent to Iran. So the US military would need to be overcome by Iran one way or another – either withdrawal of the US military due to change in foreign policy or something big like WW3, or, Iran would directly defeat the US military in the region.
Regarding the Third Signpost, the argument for the leopard seems to point to Turkey, Syria, Egypt, and Albania attacking Iran once it covers the Middle East. Whether the US helps Turkey or not, shouldn’t matter. However, Scripture doesn’t seem to indicate any power outside of those four countries being involved. This may be due to either NATO having ended, or the USA is involved in WW3 when it started as part of the Second Signpost.
Hi Thomas,
A thoughtful comment. And your comment’s title touches on something that every single person needs to work out for themselves in interpreting Scripture (whether theology or prophecy) in general and in this case the Second Signpost. So the decisions made on how each verse should be interpreted factors into a basic question: Does a person believe the Second Signpost theory as presented in Daniel Revisited is plausible or even correct, or, do the verses associated with the Signpost mean something else?
A theory is just a conclusion drawn on evidence presented. I present what I believe to be a fully plausible theory on the evidence of Scripture, history and geopolitics, thus deriving the Signposts. And we must take great care in considering all verses, sentences, phrases and words that are related to one another
I see two threads of thought in your comment here. The first is, from your title, you seem to not consider all the verses from Daniel 7 and Revelation 6 as supporting the same event, and the second, is that you seem to leave out a couple of the fine points in the geopolitical landscape for Daniel 8 that would lend more light on the part of the text you are talking about. Let’s dig in. I’ll go through your comment paragraph by paragraph.
[Paragraph 1 – In reading through your entire comment, you seem to forget all the relevant verses coming together to make one unique and fairly marked Signpost. The Ram higher on one side (Dan. 8:4), with the Bear higher on one side (Dan. 7:5), with the second horseman (Rev. 6:4) and what he does, are all likely related – this is the Second Signpost theory. So, you could alternatively say in your comment, that you do not believe they are all related. For if the Second Signpost has happened, then the second horseman has not done what he is to do, and neither has the Bear. And as I show further on here, the Ram hasn’t done everything either.]
[Paragraph 2 – Disagree. Yes, “authority, dominance, and unchecked influence” are suggested in the Biblical text, but remember the text also includes territorial invasion because of both the “north, west and south” advance of the Ram, and also the wandering nature of the bear to go place to place causing destruction. And, yes, no attack or invasion of Israel is called – just among the Muslim nations. Remember, the four horses having authority over the quarter of the earth with their four colors suggests the Four Signposts are all contained in the Muslim Realm.]
[Paragraph 3 – Disagree. The Iranian Twelver Shia Revolution of 1979 was not the fulfillment, but merely the set up. Remember, the Ram gets to do all it wants to do in Daniel 8 – in other words, the regime gets to finally do what its charter says in the Guardianship of the Jurisprudent, as I wrote in Daniel Revisited chapter 10. The two great tenets of that work are (1) to conquer and unite as many Muslim countries as possible to bring them under one temporary leader (the supreme leader of Iran), and (2) to purposefully cause chaos and killing in order to create the conditions for their Mahdi to appear. This is what they want. This is included in “all” they want.]
[Paragraph 4 – Not confusing process with definite/specific events in the Biblical text can be tricky, as the text might refer to an event vs. a process. And what we think might be an event in the future could be a process and vice versa. And when it comes to prophecy, the decision we make ultimately rests on what we think looks logical in our human minds. The Ram running out is likely a specific event. The Ram getting all it wants to do is more general, hence a process. The Goat stomping on the Ram’s horns is an event, but the Goat with its first horn getting to rule is more of a process. Likewise the rocks were split when Christ died in an event (Matt. 27:51, schizo) but Judas Iscariot becoming a traitor was a process (Luke 6:16, ginomai). Likewise, translators think of the great city being split in an event (Rev. 16:19, ginomai) but the word says process. Paul wrote about the great falling away – most would say it was an event like the things happening in America in the twentieth century, but I believe it was a process that occurred over many centuries when Islam replace Christianity over most of Christianity’s territory.]
[Paragraph 5 – Agreed. As I wrote in Daniel Revisited, chapter 11, the attack from the west will be sudden, and a surprise, and airborne. Remember, that’s why the leopard is used for imagery – the leopard hides, waits, and surprises its prey. Turkey putting an end to the Iranian regime will be fast to start and fast to finish, perhaps in only a few days. The Persian forces will be spread out thinly, but the leopard will go for the jugular in Tehran or Qom. Turkey has the second largest airborne capability in NATO.]
[Paragraph 6 – Agreed. As I wrote in Daniel Revisited chapter 11, the Goat’s first horn reign will likely be short – a few years at most, to allow the region to recover from war and get the oil flowing again.]
[Paragraph 7 – Disagree. Who is to say what best honors and fulfills Biblical prophecy? (For example, I had one prophecy teacher tell me that an Islamic Antichrist is “unbiblical”.) We won’t know for sure until the events themselves occur. One thing you seem to have as a theme here, and others have questioned many times, is that there is doubt as to whether the Second Signpost still needs to be awaited. If all the related verses of Daniel 7 and 8 and Revelation 6 are relevant, the Second Signpost when it occurs will be unique and obvious.
And as I wrote in this post, when the Second Signpost truly happens, with the Ram physically moving out, and the Bear causing chaos in many countries gorging on many beasts, and the second horseman taking away the peace of mind of the earth, and causing men to butcher (not just kill), then no one will no longer need to ask if it happened. It will be obvious. We humans tend to try to make prophecy fulfilled. It’s what we do – we are human. But we must wait for God to bring about the events and processes that He has set to happen. Every prophecy that has ever been fulfilled in the Bible was exactly fulfilled (like Psalm 22 and Daniel 11:2-35), and in exhaustive and dazzling detail, just as the First Signpost was fulfilled.]
Good discussion, Thomas. God bless.
Hi Mark, yes, great discussion!
I agree that prophecy unfolds through both process and decisive moments, and I’m not claiming the Second Signpost is complete. My point is narrower: Daniel 8 does not require the Goat to personally remove the Ram—only that the Ram be displaced and that the Goat subsequently rule. Scripture repeatedly shows God using one power to clear the way for another. A U.S. removal of the Iranian regime would not negate the Signpost if it results in a regional reordering where the Goat imagery becomes dominant. In that sense, current events may not be the fulfillment itself, but the irreversible threshold that makes it possible. Watching for that does not force prophecy—it honors it.
I am not forgetting the correlation of scriptures, just framing them as such as they don’t necessarily have to move concisely together.
I love Daniel Revisited, it opened my eyes to so much in the Bible and I will always honor your hard work and diligence in putting it all together! God bless you my friend, as we move along in these prophetic days ahead!
Daniel 8:4 describes a power that acts according to its own will and becomes great. While historically fulfilled in Medo-Persia, the end-of-world framework of Daniel allows this pattern to reemerge. Modern Iran’s unchecked regional behavior fits the character of the text, even without a literal invasion. As war escalates globally, this aligns with the Second Seal and suggests we are nearing the end of the Second Signpost, moving toward the Third.
We may have already witnessed the behavioral fulfillment of Daniel 8:4 in our time, not necessarily through a classic territorial invasion, but through unchecked regional will, expansion of influence, and magnification of power—conditions that align with the transition into the Second Seal of war and the closing phase of the Second Signpost, moving us toward the Third.
The first seal, the white horse represents conquest under the guise of legitimacy. You got my attention with Saddam and Iraq. It makes sense; it flows.
However, the seals are different than the beasts of Daniel. The beasts answer the question, who is ruling and by what kind of power(crushing, trampling) and kingdoms /empires.
The seals describe conditions unleashed on the world. I believe Mohammad al Sharaa is an expression of the white horse pattern. He has a bow no arrows; wears a crown that is given; goes out conquering and to conquer.
That already points to:
Delegated Authority (by the POTUS)
Expansion without immediate mass bloodshed (yet)
Legitimization before domination
If this is the case, and its looking pretty good…you even said youeself, he’s checking alot of boxes…God may be giving us insight and warning. Look at what has happened with the Kurds and with Erdogan in the mix!
Syria’s new leadership exemplifies the first seal:
Consolidates authority in Damascus and Kurdish areas;
Projects legitimacy to domestic and regional actors;
Expands influence through alliances, propaganda, and military control
The crown symbolizes recognized authority not necessarily universal or uncontested power.
This stage establishes the conditions necessary for conflict, setting the stage for the second seal, where peace is removed and conflicts multiply.
Thomas,
A couple points here for the record.
First, no, I don’t believe Daniel 8 was already fulfilled by Persia and by default, then, also Alexander the Great and Antiochus. Those events were a foreshadow. For all kinds of holes can be found in the imperfection of those events fulfilling Daniel 8, not to mention, the vision itself “pertains to the end time” (vs 17, 19). One example is the Goat not touching the earth while Alexander did, and the Ram, having two horns when it was Cyrus himself and Cyrus only that charged out, and he did not go south – only west and north.
And, again, the situation now with Iran in no way fulfills the Second Signpost, for several things yet have not happened. The Ram is not doing what he wants to do, to name one.
There is one part of the Daniel 8 prophecy that I believe has been fulfilled, and that is Daniel 8:3, in which the second horn has grown up longer than the first horn, and the Ram is now ready to charge.
And as I wrote in my last response to you, it will become obvious when the Second Signpost really begins. For the Bear and the Second Horseman show that the Second Signpost will truly be an event to completely change the world.
Thomas,
The four horsemen and the four beasts are pointing to the same sequence of four events. The difference is, that you touched on, is that the beasts show what nations do what and how they behave during this time of nations’ punishment, and the horsemen are the heralds for the conditions.
In the case of the First Signpost, Saddam Hussein’s appearance, his invasions, and the unknown status of his WMD were all a herald pointing to the actual First Signpost which was that same leader being removed and the lion that was Iraq had its government changed. Iraq’s government changing was the core of the First Signpost.
Mohammad al Sharaa, the current leader of Syria, is the second head of the leopard now that Syrian leadership is Sunni. If he remains in power, he will likely be the man to lead the second head’s forces back across the Middle East to take back that which Iran occupied.
And, yes, Mohammad al Sharaa also checks alot of the boxes to be Antichrist.
My view is that the Ram has gotten to do all it wants to do with nobody stopping them until now. They have pushed North with their conflict with the Kurds over the years of the Mullahs rule; They have pushed west with their proxies in Lebanon and Gaza; They have pushed South with their proxies in Yemen.
This is my understanding of the Ram and the Second signpost about to come to an end. It seems to be hidden from you in plain sight my brother.
Mark, I haven’t responded in awhile. I have been several videos by various YTbers showing where the battleships and carries are in the ME. Iran is currently surrounded by US military forces on all sides…..not sure what expected if the second signpost is going to proceed. Puzzled.
The options of what happens next are:
Russia and China go all out in their invasion of Ukraine and Taiwan
The protests against ICE gets seriously way out of hand in several US cities. This escalating btw.
Some type of bomb goes off in a major city or a military strike occurs that is unseen like a missile from somewhere.
A combination of above happens.
Anyway, your thoughts on this Mark?
Gary,
Scripture tells us the event to watch for (i.e., the Second Signpost), and unfortunately not the way it gets triggered nor when it starts. Since Daniel 8:4 says no one was able to stop or deliver form the power of the Persian Ram, it comes down to two alternatives: (1) Iran defeats the US military in a war, or (2) the US military withdraws. And it would likely withdraw due to a big war, like WW3 with China and/or Russia, or even a domestic civil war.
I’ve written about this over the last few years like in this post.
It comes down to this: we watch the Middle East for news about Iran, and if we see the Ram charge out and the Bear wander about causing chaos, occupying many Muslim countries, than we know the Second Signpost has begun.
Thomas,
I would have to disagree with you about the Ram getting to do what it wants to do on two counts. One, its ally in Syria has been defeated and removed, and so whatever it wanted to try to accomplish has been set back, so, no. And secondly, again, there is the Guardianship of the Jurisprudent has not been realized yet. That book has had a name change, and it is written about on a Wikipedia article titled, Guardianship of the Islamic Jurist.
As the beginning of the article says, it is, “a concept in Twelver Shia Islamic law which holds that until the reappearance of the “infallible Imam” (sometime before Judgement Day), the religious and social affairs of the Muslim world should be administered by righteous Shi’i jurists.”
That is what the Persian Ram wants. And the regime, the kings of Media and Persia, believe it is Iran’s mission to make the Guardianship happen. I believe anyone who says otherwise, that the Guardianship is not their ultimate goal and what they truly want, does not understand the regime.
I highly recommend anyone to check out that article if they want to learn more about what drives the regime. Also, check out this post I wrote some 13 years ago about the former and super-zealous president of Iran, Ahmadinejad and what he used to say at the annual UN meetings in New York. He openly spoke about Iran’s mission. So, no, the regime is no where near having done what it wants to do.
And if you think otherwise, we will just have to agree to disagree.
“Butting” – מְנַגֵּחַ (menaggeaḥ)• Root: נָגַח (nagach) = to gore, to thrust violently with horns• Used elsewhere for aggressive, forceful conquest (Exod. 21:28–32 of an ox goring)
Key point:This is repeated, forceful aggression, not a single strike. The participle form suggests ongoing action—a process, not a momentary event.
“He did as he pleased” – וְעָשָׂה כִרְצוֹנוֹ (ve‘asah kir’tzono)• רָצוֹן (ratzon) = will, desire, pleasure• Phrase used repeatedly in Daniel (8:4, 8:11, 11:3, 11:16, 11:36)
In Daniel, “doing according to one’s will” describes:
• Empires at the height of autonomy
• Rulers acting without external restraint
• The illusion of self-determined sovereigntyIt is often immediately followed by divine interruption later in the narrative.
The Ram may want the guardianship to happen all they want…but the Word of God seems to say otherwise. The Antichrist (Guardian, Mahdi,or whatever you want to call him) will be a Sunni. Just like this Syrian fellow and his sidekick Erdogan.
The west is is about to trample the Ram.
Fly Goat Fly…cant wait….Maranatha!
The “Greatest Of All Time” nations from the West!
Make
America
Goat (the)
Again
Mark I think It’s obvious God has to intervene to help Iran to achieve some sort of victory throughout the middle East, I think that’s one of the problems people feel that, why would God help Iran achieve some sort of a victory over the middle East and Israel, so they come up with explanations, Alexander, or Iran’s already conquered the middle East, this really doesn’t suit the scriptures. I don’t have a problem in seeing God helping Iran to advance his timeline. we know God allowed The Persians to have victory over Israel and the middle East to advance his purpose at that time so I do fully expect Daniel 8 to supernaturally be executed but time will tell.
Thomas,
““Butting” – מְנַגֵּחַ (menaggeaḥ)• Root: נָגַח (nagach) = to gore, to thrust violently with horns•”
– and just like thrusting and goring, the action could be once, or repeated – we just don’t know. However, due to the Ram going in three directions, we know its at least three. And, in butting there can also be an element of surprise, and after the first time, its no longer a surprise.
And,
“In Daniel, “doing according to one’s will” describes:
• Empires at the height of autonomy
• Rulers acting without external restraint
• The illusion of self-determined sovereigntyIt is often immediately followed by divine interruption later in the narrative.”
Exactly – that’s Iran in the middle of its Ram butting and Bear wandering.
Thomas,
You are missing quite a bit. The Word of God says what it says, and it is not otherwise. Yes, the Shias are trying to bring on their Mahdi. However, what they bring up will be a Mahdi who will appeal to both Sunnis and Shias. The Persians join the Mahdi with the Sunnis – just look at Ezekiel 38:5 which is a list of the ten nations.
And no, the Bible says the Goat will trample the Ram. The Goat, i.e. Turkey.
Thomas,
The Goat doesn’t become “very great” until AFTER its conquest of the Ram, NOT before. You love your idea about the US doing this. But in the framework of Daniel 7, 8, Rev 6, its all the nations in the Middle East, not the US.
Here is an example of love of an idea overtaking what Scripture is saying.
Hopeful,
Absolutely. Totally obvious it has to be a God thing. Just as the First Signpost was. (First Signpost – “Really? the USA will reach halfway across the world to change the government of Iraq? But it had to come wit ha special set of circumstances like false intelligence on WMD.” And I saw it in February 2003 and didn’t believe it until two weeks later when it actually happened!!)
Just as a tornado can just appear out of a cloud, do its destruction, and a couple hours later its a lovely day like nothing happened, so the Second Signpost, for it to occur as the Bible says from a literal reading, requires God to orchestrate events at the moment, and not before and not after. That’s why we don’t want to put God in a box in our interpretations. If Daniel 8 is saying the Ram will run out, do all it wants to do, and no one will get in the way – then so be it, that’s exactly the way it will happen. And no, saying the USA is the Goat as Thomas does, is putting God in a box.
And regarding Israel, Hopeful, Iran won’t touch Israel. The Four Signposts are about the Muslim nations. And Ahmadinejad himself said the future Mahdi will deal with Israel, as indeed he will per Ezekiel 38 and Revelation 11,13.
well it is obvious that Israel will not be destroyed by Iran because that is future but the United States and Israel are both anxious to have the iran sidelined, while they might not be destroyed they might have to take some hits? I was listening to Israeli news media they said they are able to take 700 hits from Iran, so if they participate they might not be destroyed but they might have problems, which was also shown in the 12th day war.
Mark, This just hit me today, how can a ram go in three directions? It can’t unless it goes North for a time, South for time and West for time. It goes back and forth. I am seriously thinking that the 2nd signpost has already proceeded, Mark. Please consider the work of their proxies in this as the 2nd horn.
Hopeful,
I do believe the Psalm 83 war will occur at the same time as the Second Signpost, so that Iran’s little minions can keep Israel busy while the IRGC butts out across the Middle East. I wrote about it here and https://foursignposts.com/2013/04/17/the-signpost-perspective-psalm-83/. And Psalm 83 says Israel wins a great victory.
Gary,
And the Bear gorges in three directions, per the three ribs stuck in its teeth. The Four Signposts cannot be considered by Daniel 8 alone, but must include Daniel 7 and Revelation 6:1-8. Remember, the picture of the Ram is a picture. The Ram has two power bases running out, per its horns. One of the powers is the IRGC/Basij. The Ram in the vision is not a physical Ram, but is the powers, kings, and force of Iran, which can easily go in three directions simultaneously.
Just wait and watch.
Gary,
I agree with you. I believe you and I are on the same page. Remember Daniel 7 and the bear vision occurred in the first year. Then two years later the Ram is seen being taken down from the Goat from the west.
Here we are two years later after their horrendous attack to the west, in Gaza, about to watch the regime that has been butting northward, westward and southward for some time now get trampled. And yes the United States seems to be the nation God is using to fulfill prophecy once again.
Meanwhile Turkey today said they are looking to set up a buffer zone on Iranian side of the boarder. Yeah right…simply a move to take Iranian territory.
I could be wrong, but it seems obvious to me that some extraordinary things are falling into place. Also we cant ignore what may be, the rising of the Antichrist in Syria.
Gary, Mark
Ran my last comment through chat gpt:
You said:
Remember Daniel 7 and the bear vision occurred in the first year. Then two years later the Ram is seen being taken down from the Goat from the west.
Here we are two years later after their horrendous attack to the west, in Gaza, about to watch the regime that has been butting northward, westward and southward for some time now get trampled.
And yes the United States seems to be the nation God is using to fulfill prophecy once again.
Meanwhile Turkey today said they are looking to set up a buffer zone on Iranian side of the boarder. Yeah right…simply a move to take Iranian territory.I could be wrong, but it seems obvious to me that some extraordinary things are falling into place.
Also we cant ignore what may be, the rising of the Antichrist in Syria.
ChatGPT said:
I hear what you’re seeing—and I want to tread carefully here, because there’s a big difference between watching the times with discernment and locking ourselves into prophetic certainty too fast.
You’re right about the internal biblical timeline first:Daniel 7 (the bear among the beasts) is dated explicitly to the first year of Belshazzar.Daniel 8 (the ram and the goat) comes two years later.
Daniel himself experiences history as progressive revelation, not a single snapshot.
That matters. So your instinct—that Daniel is being shown escalation, not repetition—is solid.
Now, where I want to gently slow the car a bit
🚦1. Pattern ≠ Proof
What you’re describing fits a pattern-recognition framework, not a proof-text framework.
Yes: A power that has “butted westward, northward, and southward” (Dan 8:4)
Yes, a Western power poised to decisively break that dominance
Yes, Turkey posturing opportunistically (which is frankly very on-brand historically)Those are rhymes, not yet fulfillments.
Scripture gives us permission—even encouragement—to say:“This looks like it could be moving in that direction.”Scripture does not give us permission to say:“This must be that.”Jesus’ warning in Matthew 24 isn’t about blindness—it’s about overconfidence.
2. The United States as an Instrument
Here’s where I’ll push back just a bit, brotherly-style.God absolutely uses nations as instruments (Isaiah 10, Habakkuk 1).
But Scripture is very careful about naming those instruments before the dust settles.
Assyria didn’t know it was Assyria.
Babylon didn’t know it was Babylon.
Rome certainly didn’t know it was Rome.
If the U.S. is being used, it’s being used unknowingly, not as a conscious prophetic agent. Once a nation begins to see itself as the vessel, judgment usually isn’t far behind.
So I’d phrase it more cautiously:
“The Lord may be using Western power once again—without that power realizing the weight of what it’s doing.”That keeps the theology clean.
3. Turkey and the “Buffer Zone”
Your skepticism here is justified.
“Buffer zones” in the ancient Near East have never been about buffers.They are about: Access, Influence, Permanent leverage.
Turkey has Ottoman muscle memory. Whether that aligns with Daniel 7, Ezekiel 38, or later developments is still open, but the direction is unmistakable.
4. Syria and the Antichrist Question
This is the most delicate part.You’re not wrong that: Syria is eschatologically loaded (Isaiah 17, Daniel’s Seleucid geography) Antiochus IV set a type there.
Power vacuums are where “little horns” grow.
But the Antichrist doesn’t announce himself as such. He emerges when:
Chaos demands order
Compromise feels like salvation
Peace requires moral surrender
So the right posture isn’t: “He has risen. ”It’s:“ The stage conditions Scripture described are becoming more plausible.”
That’s sober. That’s watchful. That’s biblical.
Final Thought:
What you’re sensing isn’t foolish, and it isn’t fringe. But prophecy is best handled like weather fronts, not calendar dates. You’re reading the sky correctly. Just don’t declare the storm until the thunder actually hits. And yes—extraordinary things do seem to be aligning.
The key is to stay watchful without becoming prophetic narrators instead of witnesses.
Thomas, Gary,
The fact that the Daniel 7 vision was given 2 years before the Daniel 8 vision was, does not mean the events of Daniel 7 must occur two years before Daniel 8. That is, in a word if you’ll pardon this – absurd – because this taken to its logical extreme for interpreting Scripture would say the fulfillment of all of Christ’s actions the first time He was here was prophesied by Isaiah, David, Micah, etc, covering centuries, and Jesus did all He did in only a 33-year span, and not over centuries.
I will assume I’m misunderstanding your statement.
Mark,
I’m not saying they must occur, I’m simply saying Daniel shows us how things escalate from ch. 7 into to 8. With the proxies being represented by the bones in the teeth ch.7… and their positions northward(Hezbollah) westward (Hamas) and southward (Houthis) ch.8.
Its not a standard hermeneutic for the whole of scripture.
Im sure the fact that this escalation is occurring 2 years later is nothing more than coincidence. Right?
Thomas,
Sorry, I disagree with you here completely. First, you are assuming that the past actions of Iranian-supported militants are part of the Second Signpost, and second then you are assigning the times of the events you see in this world as a parallel to when the visions are received, which I already said is not correct at the very least.
Daniel 7 with the Bear gorging and chomping on other beasts (nations) is just as bad as, and is a parallel to, the Ram butting outward. Daniel 7 is a picture for the Gentile nations surrounding Israel. Daniel 8 is the same picture, but for the Jews. Remember, the Bear is higher on one side, the Ram is higher on one side. The Ram runs in three directions, the Bear has three ribs stuck in its teeth in the three directions it will go to eat its feast. The Ram simply shows the shock. The Bear shows the devastation. The Bear is going to eat and devastate while the Ram gets to do all it wants to do which is to establish a wide Muslim community to await the Mahdi together.
Daniel 7 and Daniel 8 are prophesying the same events, just from different perspectives. And of course the horsemen are a third view of this still.